44 replies to this topic

[Fear Exile]

If you google Runescape Traffic, and click on the link Alexa it shows the traffic going to Runescape basically fell off a cliff from Nov 19-27

Shows the traffic for Runescape.com is falling of a cliff.

Will Jagex change? Listen, doubt it.


Would post chart, but wouldn't let me.

[Aceman]

Erm, you don't really need proof... if you were in any clans you could tell there are tons of people who have quit because of it :S not to mention the various rsc posts mentioning quitting. It's very blatant considering it's all over rsb forums too

[forsberg fan]

It's not a shocker, but it traffic was also lower mid October despite the end of this "cliff" you're referring to. I'm also sure that Jagex was well aware they were going to lose some subscribers, but it was more so done to draw in NEW players which will take time. Think of all the things they're pushing like their Facebook page in one of their recent newsposts, even the game cards in store is important exposure, and they are airing TV ads.

They won't "listen" as you expect them to because this is about the future, not a bunch of 20 something clannies/ex-clannines (the category I fall into btw) who are maxed or nearly maxed and probably have 2 months -2 years left in them before they quit RS for good. As much as they come up with frustrating updates sometimes, they are a profitable business and the game has existed for over 10 years, so they're not completely stupid.

[Fear Exile]

An update of this size should increase membership and traffic, not do the complete opposite.

[Magick]

The EoC will probably prevail in the long-term, but it is entirely expected that some people will/have quit. It does not really mean anything, and I am sure JaGEx are not surprised by it.

[No1]

If I'm looking at the same chart you were, the only dropoff is in the last two days, and it takes a couple days for the stats to even be posted and accurate. Even then the swing is hardly more than what you would normally see during the course of a week (high on weekends, low in the middle). This one will probably be more so than usual, since it was a major holiday weekend in the US. If anything, the traffic actually rose immediately following the release of EOC on the 20th.

So... no, not falling off a cliff. Sorry.

[Fear Exile]

No1, on 28 November 2012 - 06:08 PM, said:

If I'm looking at the same chart you were, the only dropoff is in the last two days, and it takes a couple days for the stats to even be posted and accurate. Even then the swing is hardly more than what you would normally see during the course of a week (high on weekends, low in the middle). This one will probably be more so than usual, since it was a major holiday weekend in the US. If anything, the traffic actually rose immediately following the release of EOC on the 20th.

So... no, not falling off a cliff. Sorry.

I'm just wondering how far it's going to fall

“Great people lead by senior managers they can't bring themselves to trust”

Current Employee in Cambridge, East of England, England (United Kingdom)
– Reviewed 3 days ago
– New
Pros – The people are great, all interesting, capable and all care about the finished product. Lots of them participate in extra-curricular activities and actively seek fresh blood and offer advice to interested parties.

Nice benefits : gym membership, pension arrangements, healthcare, subsidized canteen, good office building,

You're working for a company that makes games!

Despite all the cons below I do believe there are far worse places to work. Colleagues are very supportive when other teams are under unpleasant pressure and go out of their way to help when they can.
Cons – Unpaid overtime is expected, this is apparently industry standard but not exactly nice.Recently (last few weeks) shifted to mandatory overtime for several teams. This makes the unpaid aspect to the overtime downright unpleasant.

Limited promotion prospects; management and exec roles are mostly external hires.

History of unsuccessful attempts to branch out from the core game, each repeating some trends that could have been addressed, e.g. shifting direction frequently on key mechanics and ignoring early warning signs, such as testers and developers on the project admitting "This game isn't fun" and multiple changes in creative leads for the same product.

Communication between teams is often lacking, resulting in unnecessary, premature or wasted work.
Middle Management get panicky near milestones, resulting in sudden micromanagement and slightly raised tempers, but often appear disinterested (late for meetings discussing the project, slow to respond to questions) in the intervening periods.

No granularity on importance of decisions, every request is "critical" and "top priority" which has to be done "ASAP". Decisions may be later overruled subject to another manager or executive's whim.
Advice to Senior Management – Review projects regularly, especially before putting significant investment into them, and be prepared to cut projects that don't look worth it any more.

Pick some individuals you trust to have a complete and detailed vision for a given product. Back their decisions and make sure they have as much visibility as possible of what is going on in their given product.

The image you give to your workers is important, they currently seem to think you haven't a clue. Better-informed workers are better able to trust you, know what parts of their work are important and make decisions when unexpected problems arise which fulfil the spirit of the instructions they've been given .

[Dr Destiny]

No1, on 28 November 2012 - 06:08 PM, said:

If I'm looking at the same chart you were, the only dropoff is in the last two days, and it takes a couple days for the stats to even be posted and accurate. Even then the swing is hardly more than what you would normally see during the course of a week (high on weekends, low in the middle). This one will probably be more so than usual, since it was a major holiday weekend in the US. If anything, the traffic actually rose immediately following the release of EOC on the 20th.

So... no, not falling off a cliff. Sorry.

I just have to argue that the only reason the traffic rose following the release of EOC was because everyone was rushing to get on to see how it was, whether they would like it, and a bunch of other things. It's like after an update, people go on to see how it is.

[No1]

Dr Destiny, on 28 November 2012 - 06:42 PM, said:

I just have to argue that the only reason the traffic rose following the release of EOC was because everyone was rushing to get on to see how it was, whether they would like it, and a bunch of other things. It's like after an update, people go on to see how it is.

True... but that is the opposite of everyone quitting.

[zxpurekillxz]

This game was done a long time ago

[GuiltySpark]

@ OP It seems to me that you're pulling out graphs and quotes from websites to paint Jagex as a bad guy, but without any clear point that you're trying to articulate. So what that people are quitting over the short term, and what does Jagex's management style even have to do with the EoC? EoC is intended to be a long term solution to a long standing problem- the old, boring click-and-wait combat system. They don't care, and shouldn't care, about the veteran players like you and me quitting, because we were bound to quit soon anyway. Even around these forums, you always hear players saying "I'm only playing because of x, the rest of the game is crap", with x usually being clanning or PvM. Why would they want to keep an outdated system to satisfy players that are only half dedicated to the game, when there's a huge sea of potential Runescape players that could be attracted to the new system?

[Fear Exile]

GuiltySpark, on 28 November 2012 - 07:03 PM, said:

@ OP It seems to me that you're pulling out graphs and quotes from websites to paint Jagex as a bad guy, but without any clear point that you're trying to articulate. So what that people are quitting over the short term, and what does Jagex's management style even have to do with the EoC? EoC is intended to be a long term solution to a long standing problem- the old, boring click-and-wait combat system. They don't care, and shouldn't care, about the veteran players like you and me quitting, because we were bound to quit soon anyway. Even around these forums, you always hear players saying "I'm only playing because of x, the rest of the game is crap", with x usually being clanning or PvM. Why would they want to keep an outdated system to satisfy players that are only half dedicated to the game, when there's a huge sea of potential Runescape players that could be attracted to the new system?

Why would new players play Runescape over WoW, Star Wars, Guild Wars, EtC?

[Dr Destiny]

Fear Exile, on 28 November 2012 - 07:09 PM, said:

GuiltySpark, on 28 November 2012 - 07:03 PM, said:

@ OP It seems to me that you're pulling out graphs and quotes from websites to paint Jagex as a bad guy, but without any clear point that you're trying to articulate. So what that people are quitting over the short term, and what does Jagex's management style even have to do with the EoC? EoC is intended to be a long term solution to a long standing problem- the old, boring click-and-wait combat system. They don't care, and shouldn't care, about the veteran players like you and me quitting, because we were bound to quit soon anyway. Even around these forums, you always hear players saying "I'm only playing because of x, the rest of the game is crap", with x usually being clanning or PvM. Why would they want to keep an outdated system to satisfy players that are only half dedicated to the game, when there's a huge sea of potential Runescape players that could be attracted to the new system?

Why would new players play Runescape over WoW, Star Wars, Guild Wars, EtC?

Pretty sure WoW costs money, not sure about the other games but your definetely right. But it's like that for most things, theres always competition. I guess Jagex thinks and what some people are trying to state here are that the people who enjoy the old rs are the people who are gonna quit real soon down the road and their trying to attract new players and keep up with modern technology. Their trying to think of the bigger picture here, whether they are doing the right thing or not we can only see in the future to come.

Edited by Dr Destiny, 28 November 2012 - 07:23 PM.

[Semmm]

Fear Exile, on 28 November 2012 - 07:09 PM, said:

GuiltySpark, on 28 November 2012 - 07:03 PM, said:

@ OP It seems to me that you're pulling out graphs and quotes from websites to paint Jagex as a bad guy, but without any clear point that you're trying to articulate. So what that people are quitting over the short term, and what does Jagex's management style even have to do with the EoC? EoC is intended to be a long term solution to a long standing problem- the old, boring click-and-wait combat system. They don't care, and shouldn't care, about the veteran players like you and me quitting, because we were bound to quit soon anyway. Even around these forums, you always hear players saying "I'm only playing because of x, the rest of the game is crap", with x usually being clanning or PvM. Why would they want to keep an outdated system to satisfy players that are only half dedicated to the game, when there's a huge sea of potential Runescape players that could be attracted to the new system?

Why would new players play Runescape over WoW, Star Wars, Guild Wars, EtC?

Because its browser based so people with crapty computers can play it. It costs like 7 bucks a month whereas WoW is 15 plus the game plus all of the expainsions. Star wars and guild wars require you to shell out like 60 bucks at once. RS is targeted at 12 year olds and its probably easier for a 12 year old to convince their parents to shell out 7 bucks rather than 60 bucks for a video game.

[B.A. Baracus]

Semmm, on 28 November 2012 - 09:49 PM, said:

Because its browser based so people with crapty computers can play it. It costs like 7 bucks a month whereas WoW is 15 plus the game plus all of the expainsions. Star wars and guild wars require you to shell out like 60 bucks at once. RS is targeted at 12 year olds and its probably easier for a 12 year old to convince their parents to shell out 7 bucks rather than 60 bucks for a video game.

The game with a 13+ age requirement is targeting 12 year olds? That's news to me. On topic, it's not that big of a deal that a bunch of players are quitting, it happens. We'll see what happens in the long run, really no point in speculating this early on.

[ʸᵃʸ]

yes, because a ONE WEEK trend is a great example for long-term behaviours

if you control any investment portfolios, mutual funds, etc, please stop right now

also we're still in the week of ragequitters, half of them will be back within a month

[Kachoks]

Semmm, on 28 November 2012 - 09:49 PM, said:

Fear Exile, on 28 November 2012 - 07:09 PM, said:

GuiltySpark, on 28 November 2012 - 07:03 PM, said:

@ OP It seems to me that you're pulling out graphs and quotes from websites to paint Jagex as a bad guy, but without any clear point that you're trying to articulate. So what that people are quitting over the short term, and what does Jagex's management style even have to do with the EoC? EoC is intended to be a long term solution to a long standing problem- the old, boring click-and-wait combat system. They don't care, and shouldn't care, about the veteran players like you and me quitting, because we were bound to quit soon anyway. Even around these forums, you always hear players saying "I'm only playing because of x, the rest of the game is crap", with x usually being clanning or PvM. Why would they want to keep an outdated system to satisfy players that are only half dedicated to the game, when there's a huge sea of potential Runescape players that could be attracted to the new system?

Why would new players play Runescape over WoW, Star Wars, Guild Wars, EtC?

Star wars and guild wars require you to shell out like 60 bucks at once.

Start wars are f2p now :P (Quite same as RS, only at SWTOR f2p has way more things to do (for example - you have acces to the whole story), and p2p costs like 15$ (or less if you buy more months), which is not that high. Playing it myself right now :)

[GuiltySpark]

Semmm, on 28 November 2012 - 09:49 PM, said:

Because its browser based so people with crapty computers can play it. It costs like 7 bucks a month whereas WoW is 15 plus the game plus all of the expainsions. Star wars and guild wars require you to shell out like 60 bucks at once. RS is targeted at 12 year olds and its probably easier for a 12 year old to convince their parents to shell out 7 bucks rather than 60 bucks for a video game.

Exactly... took the words right out of my mouth.

Edited by GuiltySpark, 29 November 2012 - 12:34 AM.

[Rodney King]

B.A. Baracus, on 28 November 2012 - 10:43 PM, said:

Semmm, on 28 November 2012 - 09:49 PM, said:

Because its browser based so people with crapty computers can play it. It costs like 7 bucks a month whereas WoW is 15 plus the game plus all of the expainsions. Star wars and guild wars require you to shell out like 60 bucks at once. RS is targeted at 12 year olds and its probably easier for a 12 year old to convince their parents to shell out 7 bucks rather than 60 bucks for a video game.

The game with a 13+ age requirement is targeting 12 year olds? That's news to me. On topic, it's not that big of a deal that a bunch of players are quitting, it happens. We'll see what happens in the long run, really no point in speculating this early on.

They removed the 13+ age requirement. You can make an account as a 12 year old techically, your just limited to quick chat. And what 12yr old these days would be dumb enough to do that?

I'd much rather pay a one off fee of $60 as opposed to $7/15 a month, if the content kept getting updated and was exciting and enhanced the reason why I started playing the game. I can see games like Guild Wars revert to monthly payments if they build enough critical mass of players.

Fear Exile, on 28 November 2012 - 06:29 PM, said:

No1, on 28 November 2012 - 06:08 PM, said:

If I'm looking at the same chart you were, the only dropoff is in the last two days, and it takes a couple days for the stats to even be posted and accurate. Even then the swing is hardly more than what you would normally see during the course of a week (high on weekends, low in the middle). This one will probably be more so than usual, since it was a major holiday weekend in the US. If anything, the traffic actually rose immediately following the release of EOC on the 20th.

So... no, not falling off a cliff. Sorry.

I'm just wondering how far it's going to fall

“Great people lead by senior managers they can't bring themselves to trust”

  

Spoiler

Current Employee in Cambridge, East of England, England (United Kingdom)
– Reviewed 3 days ago
– New
Pros – The people are great, all interesting, capable and all care about the finished product. Lots of them participate in extra-curricular activities and actively seek fresh blood and offer advice to interested parties.

Nice benefits : gym membership, pension arrangements, healthcare, subsidized canteen, good office building,

You're working for a company that makes games!

Despite all the cons below I do believe there are far worse places to work. Colleagues are very supportive when other teams are under unpleasant pressure and go out of their way to help when they can.
Cons – Unpaid overtime is expected, this is apparently industry standard but not exactly nice.Recently (last few weeks) shifted to mandatory overtime for several teams. This makes the unpaid aspect to the overtime downright unpleasant.

Limited promotion prospects; management and exec roles are mostly external hires.

History of unsuccessful attempts to branch out from the core game, each repeating some trends that could have been addressed, e.g. shifting direction frequently on key mechanics and ignoring early warning signs, such as testers and developers on the project admitting "This game isn't fun" and multiple changes in creative leads for the same product.

Communication between teams is often lacking, resulting in unnecessary, premature or wasted work.
Middle Management get panicky near milestones, resulting in sudden micromanagement and slightly raised tempers, but often appear disinterested (late for meetings discussing the project, slow to respond to questions) in the intervening periods.

No granularity on importance of decisions, every request is "critical" and "top priority" which has to be done "ASAP". Decisions may be later overruled subject to another manager or executive's whim.
Advice to Senior Management – Review projects regularly, especially before putting significant investment into them, and be prepared to cut projects that don't look worth it any more.

Pick some individuals you trust to have a complete and detailed vision for a given product. Back their decisions and make sure they have as much visibility as possible of what is going on in their given product.

The image you give to your workers is important, they currently seem to think you haven't a clue. Better-informed workers are better able to trust you, know what parts of their work are important and make decisions when unexpected problems arise which fulfil the spirit of the instructions they've been given .

Read the article. Not surprised one bit that Senior Leadership and Career Opportunities scored poorly. Ever since Andrew Gower, Paul Gower and Constant Tedder left the board in late 2010 things have gotten worse and the wider community has been ignored on important updates and additions to the game.

No wonder the staff feel like they can't help more with their hands tied behind their backs.

Edited by Rodney King, 29 November 2012 - 12:53 AM.

[qazbob12]

Fear Exile, on 28 November 2012 - 07:09 PM, said:

GuiltySpark, on 28 November 2012 - 07:03 PM, said:

@ OP It seems to me that you're pulling out graphs and quotes from websites to paint Jagex as a bad guy, but without any clear point that you're trying to articulate. So what that people are quitting over the short term, and what does Jagex's management style even have to do with the EoC? EoC is intended to be a long term solution to a long standing problem- the old, boring click-and-wait combat system. They don't care, and shouldn't care, about the veteran players like you and me quitting, because we were bound to quit soon anyway. Even around these forums, you always hear players saying "I'm only playing because of x, the rest of the game is crap", with x usually being clanning or PvM. Why would they want to keep an outdated system to satisfy players that are only half dedicated to the game, when there's a huge sea of potential Runescape players that could be attracted to the new system?

Why would new players play Runescape over WoW, Star Wars, Guild Wars, EtC?

Not everyone wants That kind of playstyle. Not everyone's likes the mainstream, you know.

Edited by qazbob12, 29 November 2012 - 03:43 PM.