54 replies to this topic

[Murdoc]

The recent announcement of a launch date for Evolution of Combat certainly garnered a lot of attention! Your level of passion and dedication is obvious to see. It's you guys who make RuneScape the uniquely amazing game that it is, and your enjoyment as RuneScape players is of paramount importance to us. As such, the decision to launch the Evolution of Combat into the live game was not taken lightly.

We’ve eagerly listened to the excellent constructive feedback from those of you taking part in the Evolution of Combat Beta. During the last five months, we’ve worked hard to implement your suggested changes and improvements thanks to that feedback. This culminated last week in the beta launch of the Combat Academy and a survey to gauge the opinions of those of you who had given the system a try.

We’d like to thank the many tens of thousands of you who took the time to take part. The results below are completely as captured (the responses haven’t been weighted in any way shape or form and no negative responses were removed) and additionally we’ve included some of our own further analysis to help give you some insight into how the data stacks up. We’re naturally looking forward to hearing your thoughts on these figures too!

Question 1. What is your current combat level in the live game?

1-20 = 1.93% of users
21-40 = 1.67%
41-60 = 3.37%
61-100 = 23.84%
101-120 = 28.04%
121-138 = 41.14%

As you might expect, high-level combat players formed the largest proportion of users in the beta, with 69% of the respondents being level 101 or higher. It's terrific to see that those of you who've used RuneScape’s combat system the most over the years make up the majority of respondents providing feedback.

Question 2. Which of the following best describes your play-style?

I focus on fighting monsters = 11.97%
I focus on quests and the storyline = 8.77%
I focus on non-combat skilling = 6.82%
I do a bit of everything = 65.44%
I focus on PvP = 4.29%
I play for the social aspect and my friendships = 2.71%

This result surprised us a little, as we were expecting the responses to be more weighted towards combat-focused players. It's always been clear the Evolution of Combat benefits everyone - not just high-level combat players - and this is a clear indication of that fact. We're throwing every resource available at ensuring that it's right for the job.

Question 3. How much time have you spent in the beta previously?

This is my first time = 22.12%
Between five minutes and an hour = 21.40%
Between one hour and four hours = 30.85%
Between four hours and ten hours = 15.12%
Between ten hours and twenty hours = 5.79%
More than twenty hours = 4.72%

We knew that many of you had previously avoided the beta because they gained no direct benefit on their live account (and free time is very precious!), so we had expected that the range here would skew towards under four hours, which proved to be the case.

Question 4. After playing the Combat Academy, do you now feel you have a good understanding of the new combat system?

Yes, I understand the system well = 34.0%
I think I understand most of it = 33.03%
I already understood it from playing the earlier beta = 17.43%
There are parts of it I don't yet understand = 6.54%
I find the whole new system confusing = 7.22%
I feel it made it even more confusing! = 1.77%

Over 80% of users replied here that they had a decent understanding of the new system. We’ve taken your feedback on board regarding areas of the academy that could be improved, and those changes will be released with the Evolution of Combat on the 20th of November.

Question 5. Out of the following, what do you like most about the Evolution of Combat?

Dual wielding = 31.05%
The action bar, new interfaces & shortcuts = 26.12%
The different abilities = 19.69%
The ability to switch enemy targeting = 1.17%
The adrenaline system = 5.99%
The new combat animations = 15.98%

We believe Dual wielding is one of the coolest things in the Evolution of Combat and this was reflected in your responses. The action bar is also a particularly useful new addition, as it can be used for skilling and combat, and this was reflected in it being the next most popular feature.

Question 6. Overall, what are your thoughts on the new combat system?

I definitely prefer it to the old system = 20.31%
I like it so far, but can't yet be sure = 19.14%
I don't like it = 19.62%
It's OK, but needs improvement = 14.31%
I like both the new and the old systems = 25.97%
I don't do combat, so have no opinion = 0.66%

This was always going to be the question that got the most attention, and understandably so. We’ve been following forum and general community sentiment very closely since the launch of the beta; as we’ve made many of the suggested changes & improvements there was an increasingly positive feeling about the update, which is backed-up by these results. Of course, we intend to keep listening to your feedback and improving the Combat System post-launch, so things can only get better from here.

Over 80% of respondents who played the latest Evolution of Combat Beta either preferred it or had a generally positive response to it. We also looked at this answer broken down by player level and found that there was little variation in response percentages, so it has support across all levels.

We're especially interested in hearing the opinion of those of you who said you weren't happy with the new system. If you haven't already, we really hope you'll give the Evolution of Combat a shot upon launch, especially to see how much it has changed since the early betas. To smooth the transition, we’ll release with a range of guides, Q&As and insider info, including how you can still use Evolution of Combat for traditional, low-intensity combat.

The launch of the Evolution of Combat is a huge step for RuneScape – thank you for your continued support and for your feedback so far, and we hope to see you on the battlefield soon!

The RuneScape Team

Discuss this here.

[Xtrm]

I think that more players need to give the new combat system a fighting chance before they up and quit RuneScape. The current combat system is boring and outdated (I've said this hundreds of times) and needs to be updated if Jagex wants to compete with the latest MMOs.

[Nitromanic]

Quote

To smooth the transition, we’ll release with a range of guides, Q&As and insider info, including how you can still use Evolution of Combat for traditional, low-intensity combat.

There is still hope! Question 6 was a tad biased, considering 4 of the 6 choices were pretty much EoC please. I for one, am not completely sure about EoC, I don't particularly want it but I'll welcome it and give it a try.

Edited by Nitromanic, 09 November 2012 - 11:27 AM.

[05grogan]

Honestly find the whole system boring now. Runescape was attractive to me in 2001 because It was simple. Even up to 2007 or so it was simple and enjoyable.

The game is trying to follow the paths of other MMORPG's too much which to me loses a lot of uniqueness. Sure it's browser based and all that stuff but for a few dollars you can buy a game such a guild wars (orig) which is much more 'whole' than even this system.

I personally don't play outside clanning anyway. I'll see how the clan world adjusts and if most clans close/die off then I will have no reason to play anymore. I lost the appeal of RS when they messed up PVP in 2007, and introduced AFKscape.

[sev1627]

I'm surprised that 80% said they enjoyed it. I mean I did and think this will be a good edition to the game but I've seen about a million people who hate on it.

[Magick]

What a joke, oh well, time to suck up it up and move on.

sev1627, on 09 November 2012 - 11:36 AM, said:

I'm surprised that 80% said they enjoyed it. I mean I did and think this will be a good edition to the game but I've seen about a million people who hate on it.

80% of the people who participated in the recent Combat Academy thing... if it was a true reflection of players [counting the disgruntled ones who want nothing to do with the beta], the figure would be nowhere close to that.

Edited by Magick, 09 November 2012 - 11:41 AM.

[sev1627]

Magick, on 09 November 2012 - 11:38 AM, said:

What a joke, oh well, time to suck up it up and move on.

sev1627, on 09 November 2012 - 11:36 AM, said:

I'm surprised that 80% said they enjoyed it. I mean I did and think this will be a good edition to the game but I've seen about a million people who hate on it.

80% of the people who participated in the recent Combat Academy thing... if it was a true reflection of players [counting the disgruntled ones who want nothing to do with the beta], the figure would be nowhere close to that.

Ahh, true. Well, I don't get it. Why hate before you try it?

[Evil.]

A potential 45.11% of players would be in favor of keeping the current combat system (question 6, options 3 and 5). Yet Jagex don't really seem to care, and they're just pushing EoC on us.

So many people have spoken out against it, and even provided methods of getting around the problem (introduce an old system server or two), yet Jagex takes no notice, or simply doesn't care.

It's seriously frustrating; I've been a pure for the last 6 years of RS and now I'm forced to play the game the way Jagex wants me to play it (with defence and crapty abilities, etc; trying to copy other MMOs). What made RuneScape unique was the dozens of possible combat stat setups that defined your character. Those who view this as "cheating" the system are ignorant and are probably too lazy to put in the valuable time to make a unique account.

Anyways, I suppose if no change is made to accomodate the large portion of us who hate the EoC (personally, I've played it on my 136 main and STILL hate it), I'm just going to quit. I'm guessing many others will follow in suit. My entire friends list comprises of pures, some of which are in clans, who will be totally nerfed from EoC. Even berserker pures get the short end of the stick with this update; a main with rounded stats will destroy a berserker the same level in EoC. Being forced to play the game a certain way makes it boring, repetitive, and useless to me.

Gf rs, 2001-2007 & 2011-2012

[No1]

Magick, on 09 November 2012 - 11:38 AM, said:

sev1627, on 09 November 2012 - 11:36 AM, said:

I'm surprised that 80% said they enjoyed it. I mean I did and think this will be a good edition to the game but I've seen about a million people who hate on it.

80% of the people who participated in the recent Combat Academy thing... if it was a true reflection of players [counting the disgruntled ones who want nothing to do with the beta], the figure would be nowhere close to that.

And yet... if they haven't even tried it properly, are they really in a position to say 'good' or 'bad'?

At any rate, I don't think the number of people against it is anywhere as high as you make it out to be. There aren't a lot of you, proportionally; you just speak more loudly.

[Xtrm]

Evil., on 09 November 2012 - 11:44 AM, said:

Gf rs, 2001-2007 & 2011-2012

If they don't put out the EoC, the game will die eventually anyways. If a new player is looking for a MMO to play, are they going to go for a interactive combat system or a click-AFK system? If you're going to quit over the EoC, good-bye. The EoC will finally bring some challenge into the game that it has been lacking for years.

[Magick]

sev1627, on 09 November 2012 - 11:42 AM, said:

Magick, on 09 November 2012 - 11:38 AM, said:

What a joke, oh well, time to suck up it up and move on.

sev1627, on 09 November 2012 - 11:36 AM, said:

I'm surprised that 80% said they enjoyed it. I mean I did and think this will be a good edition to the game but I've seen about a million people who hate on it.

80% of the people who participated in the recent Combat Academy thing... if it was a true reflection of players [counting the disgruntled ones who want nothing to do with the beta], the figure would be nowhere close to that.

Ahh, true. Well, I don't get it. Why hate before you try it?

People have tried it... for the past 5 months, and they have already formed their opinion [and left in some cases]. Now, JaGEx released the Combat Academy recently and put a poll at the end of it as if it would not be in the favour of the remaining [those who enjoy it].

Edited by Magick, 09 November 2012 - 11:51 AM.

[Lieutenant Dan]

sev1627, on 09 November 2012 - 11:42 AM, said:

Spoiler

Magick, on 09 November 2012 - 11:38 AM, said:

What a joke, oh well, time to suck up it up and move on.

sev1627, on 09 November 2012 - 11:36 AM, said:

I'm surprised that 80% said they enjoyed it. I mean I did and think this will be a good edition to the game but I've seen about a million people who hate on it.

80% of the people who participated in the recent Combat Academy thing... if it was a true reflection of players [counting the disgruntled ones who want nothing to do with the beta], the figure would be nowhere close to that.

Ahh, true. Well, I don't get it. Why hate before you try it?

Because people are too stubborn and set in their ways to give something a fighting chance and would rather write it off as useless or stupid before giving it a fighting shot. It's the same reasons that old people have for not changing their sets of beliefs. My grandmother is still fully convinced that homosexuals are ruining the foundations of America, for example. We all know that that claim is baseless and untrue, but there is no amount of reasoning with her. I love my grandmother to death, but still... Old people (i.e. the veterans of RuneScape) are highly resistant to change. It's just how we as humans are programmed.

[Da Bazz]

Question 6 is so biased. I couldn't say that I didn't like it but then again I don't enjoy it and a option inbetween just wasn't there other then it needs improvement...
I posted a topic about Dual Wielding weapons on the forums 3-4 years ago already so on that they are kinda late imo...But it's still the best feature the beta offers, the combat animations are kinda ugly. They tried making it look and feel like other MMORPG' styles but it's just not on that level. As for the combat level question I think they should have divided 120-138 into 120-134 and 134-138 cause of the huge difference in XP. It's probably more then 40m combat XP between 120-138 which is alot of in game time. The players with 120-134 combat are with way more then those from 134-138, which gives a wrong impression to the voting. Because the 134+ unit are the more hardcore/old school players most of the time and it takes like 2-3 months to get up to 120 cmb these days.

We'll see how things evolve for the clan world but I doubt that it's going to be any better then the current situation...

[Magick]

No1, on 09 November 2012 - 11:45 AM, said:

Magick, on 09 November 2012 - 11:38 AM, said:

sev1627, on 09 November 2012 - 11:36 AM, said:

I'm surprised that 80% said they enjoyed it. I mean I did and think this will be a good edition to the game but I've seen about a million people who hate on it.

80% of the people who participated in the recent Combat Academy thing... if it was a true reflection of players [counting the disgruntled ones who want nothing to do with the beta], the figure would be nowhere close to that.

And yet... if they haven't even tried it properly, are they really in a position to say 'good' or 'bad'?

At any rate, I don't think the number of people against it is anywhere as high as you make it out to be. There aren't a lot of you, proportionally; you just speak more loudly.

I just addressed this in my previous response, it is a biased poll. Also, many, who have tried it within the past 5 months, have already quit over the thought of the looming update.

e: In fact, I am even campaigning against the EoC here, I am more annoyed that I have yet to see JaGEx conduct a survey that does not skew the results towards what they want. I know the EoC will be implemented, I have no qualms with that, but for them to use this to claim that the majority support it is out of order.

Edited by Magick, 09 November 2012 - 12:11 PM.

[Robinhoodrs]

I played the beta a couple times, didn't know anything about this poll until now, that's along with pretty much the whole of Brutality and my team, we knew nothing about it so couldn't vote. Oh well, good old Jagex trying to hide the real figures to make it look not as bad.

[Lieutenant Dan]

Robinhoodrs, on 09 November 2012 - 11:51 AM, said:

I played the beta a couple times, didn't know anything about this poll until now, that's along with pretty much the whole of Brutality and my team, we knew nothing about it so couldn't vote. Oh well, good old Jagex trying to hide the real figures to make it look not as bad.

Except those are the results from the Combat Academy... If you actually had an opinion that you wanted expressed in the poll then I guess you should have bucked up and played the academy. But the anti-EoC camp is so stuck up that they don't want to try it to give feedback, they just want to bash it into oblivion. If you'd actually put a reasonable amount of time into the EoC you'd see how surprisingly wonderful it is.

[Evil.]

Xtrm, on 09 November 2012 - 11:46 AM, said:

Evil., on 09 November 2012 - 11:44 AM, said:

Gf rs, 2001-2007 & 2011-2012

If they don't put out the EoC, the game will die eventually anyways. If a new player is looking for a MMO to play, are they going to go for a interactive combat system or a click-AFK system? If you're going to quit over the EoC, good-bye. The EoC will finally bring some challenge into the game that it has been lacking for years.

The "interactive" combat system is not really interactive at all; it just introduces a whole lot of a clicking. It poses no real challenge, other than spamming stuns/binds/threshold/ultimate abilities. The main point of the new system is such; spam abilities and you will do damage. Furthermore, all accounts are pretty much forced to have rounded stats, with 99 prayer, 99 summoning, and 99 hp. In the old system, I could make an addy daddy, barrows pure, zerker, 1 def pure, vesta pure, etc.

I find no lack of interactivity in the current system. I PK for roughly 3-4 hours a day, and constantly use different weapons, combos, or hybrid setups. I bank often to get different weapons to use different strategies to ko people. Those who choose to play RS with a whip and a shield and just afk all the time will find themselves doing the same in EoC with momentum. Those who actually enjoy using current weapons to find strategies will get the short end of the stick with PvP, and will likely quit.

I find it somewhat sad that EoC is seen as challenging. Go play LoL or WoW if you want any type of challenge with combat.

[Milktea4me]

This survey should've gotten more publicity than it has. I only discovered this survey through a video rather than the update page. If it was like the survey regarding the Free Trade vs. No Free Trade, I think the results would be much different.

[Lieutenant Dan]

Milktea4me, on 09 November 2012 - 12:01 PM, said:

This survey should've gotten more publicity than it has. I only discovered this survey through a video rather than the update page. If it was like the survey regarding the Free Trade vs. No Free Trade, I think the results would be much different.

if they had done that, the very vocal minority would have created tens of thousands of dummy accounts to skew the voting page. Also, if people would actually read the updates it was clear as day that there was going to be a poll at the end of the Combat Academy. See below:

Combat Beta, Combat Academy & XP Reward: Open to All, on 02 November 2012 - 09:18 AM, said:

Make it through Deathknell's rigorous regimen of training in the beta and you'll have the opportunity to take part in a short survey. With this, we'll fine-tune the new tutorial to give everyone the know-how they need to become all-conquering combatants. Complete this and you'll be sent a tasty XP reward in the live game (equivalent to 10 times the XP you'd get from a Jack of Trades aura) on the week commencing with the 19th of November 2012.

Edited by Lieutenant Dan, 09 November 2012 - 12:04 PM.

[Evil.]

Milktea4me, on 09 November 2012 - 12:01 PM, said:

This survey should've gotten more publicity than it has. I only discovered this survey through a video rather than the update page. If it was like the survey regarding the Free Trade vs. No Free Trade, I think the results would be much different.

This is exactly what I was thinking. I didn't even know a survey existed until I saw this front page post.

Evil., on 09 November 2012 - 12:03 PM, said:

Milktea4me, on 09 November 2012 - 12:01 PM, said:

This survey should've gotten more publicity than it has. I only discovered this survey through a video rather than the update page. If it was like the survey regarding the Free Trade vs. No Free Trade, I think the results would be much different.

This is exactly what I was thinking. I didn't even know a survey existed until I saw this front page post.

@Jay; Damn, my survey never came up. I finished the combat academy and no survey came :o

hah, nevermind my post