[Goyatuzo]

I remember back in the day where dying risked your entire inventory, except for your "3 most important items." (PvE) It made me think twice about dying and I went out of my way to almost over-prepare for various slaying jobs. Fire Giants - I knew they were a quick and easy kill, yet I decided to bring half an inventory of prayer potions with the other half being sharks. It is my problem, I know, but I liked the feeling anxiousness and nervousness of preparing to slay new creatures. It made RuneScape from a dull to an interesting game.

Now, Jagex gives you the chance of regaining all your items for up to 1 hour with friends blessing your grave. Now, does anyone else see the awkwardness of that? dying is supposed to feel like a failure, should feel like an action that should be avoided at all costs, and every time you die you're supposed to learn something you should do different; but the RuneScape of today does not give me that feeling. If you have a whole 60 minutes to get back to your gravestone, you can basically walk there and still be able to get all your stuff back. The base 6 minutes isn't that much of a deal either. Now there's a bank underneath Lumbridge Castle, you can quickly get your teleport runes, teleport to the nearest area you died and run. Usually, unless it's somewhere far, you can get there in time.

Reconstructing Death

This suggestion will NOT be reflected upon PvP worlds. You can die as much as you want there.

So, to revamp the death system in the game, I've come up with an additional attribute to death. Each time you die, you will receive a "Mark of Death" which is not visible in your inventory. Rather, it is a number that accumulates each time you die and each point that is added to this number will decrease the chances of you receiving a rare drop. In fact, each point will take away certain item drops. If a player has any skill above level 20, marks will begin to accumulate. On the other hand, if ALL your skills are below level 20, marks will NOT accumulate.

Each of the prices are all based on Grand Exchange prices
Bones and 100% drop items will always drop until you get 15 points. You can only receive 4 marks a day. After that, the marks will not accumulate but you will not be able to wear the armor that is best to your defense level. For an example, if you have level 40 defense, you will not be able to wear Rune. If you have 47, you still will not be able to wear Rune. However, once you reach level 50, you will not be able to wear Dragon; but you CAN wear Rune.

1 point - drops worth less than or equal to 100g
2 points - drops worth less than or equal to 1k
3 points - drops worth less than or equal to 10k
4 points - drops worth less than or equal to 100k
5 points - drops worth less than or equal to 150k
6 points - drops worth less than or equal to 250k
7 points - drops worth less than or equal to 500k
8 points - drops worth less than or equal to 800k
9 points - drops worth less than or equal to 1M
10 points - drops worth less than or equal to 1.5M
11 points - drops worth less than or equal to 2.5M
12 points - drops worth less than or equal to 4M
13 points - drops worth less than or equal to 6M
14 points - drops worth less than or equal to 10M
15 points - items will not drop. Not even bones, money, or 100% drops.

NOTE: You can still buy from the Grand Exchange, there are no limits on that but the actual drop (i.e. Abbysal Whip from Abbysal Demons) will be prevented from dropping from the monster.

You have two options of reducing your "Mark of Death" count.

• Pay off a Mortician
  
• Lose some experience off of EVERY skill (Your level WILL decrease if it goes below the level XP)

Mortician
You can choose to pay off the Mortician, but his prices are expensive. He is located in the Lumbridge Morgue. Each payment only reduces ONE point.

If your total points are 2 and below, your price will be half the formula.

For Combat levels 24 and below

Spoiler

For all players: Combat Level x 10 x points

For Combat levels below 25

Spoiler

For all players: Combat Level x 100 x points

For Combat levels 25 - 49

Spoiler

Free Members: Combat Level x 1000 x points
Members: Combat Level x 1500 x points

For Combat levels 50 - 75

Spoiler

Free Members: Combat Level x 1250 x points
Members: Combat Level x 2000 x points

For Combat levels 76 - 100

Spoiler

Free Members: Combat level x 2000 x points
Members: Combat level x 10000 x points

For Combat levels 100-125

Spoiler

Free Members: Combat level x 4000 x points
Members: Combat level x 20000 x points

For Combat Levels 126 (NOT with Summoning)
It will be handled with experience only. Do not worry; it's optional.

Experience
You can go to the King of Varrock and request your name be cleared in exchange for experience. Half your skills will randomly be chosen. Each "payment" will reduce TWO points.

If your total marks are 2 and below, your experience cut will be half the formula.

People with Combat Level 126 without Summoning can choose to have their stats reduced or not.

Each skill's loss is independent from one another.

For every player, you will lose 0.5% of your experience from each skill.

C&C is encouraged, and you can even flame a little too. Helps if I get severe criticism as long as I can see the other's point.

This post has been edited by Goyatuzo: 29 November 2009 - 04:02 PM

[bolshevik]

I really don't think this is a great idea at all simply because you have to take into account the PVP worlds, people die there quite often. I can understand the occasionally dying on slayer tasks, or in other places, but if anything should be changed, it's the taking into account the PVP world "equation."

[Hail]

Bolshevik, on 22 November 2009 - 05:04 PM, said:

I really don't think this is a great idea at all simply because you have to take into account the PVP worlds, people die there quite often. I can understand the occasionally dying on slayer tasks, or in other places, but if anything should be changed, it's the taking into account the PVP world "equation."

I really doubt this is meant to affect PvP Worlds at all.

[Goyatuzo]

Bolshevik, on 22 November 2009 - 05:04 PM, said:

I really don't think this is a great idea at all simply because you have to take into account the PVP worlds, people die there quite often. I can understand the occasionally dying on slayer tasks, or in other places, but if anything should be changed, it's the taking into account the PVP world "equation."

I've forgotten to add that part. You and Hail asked me so I just decided to put it right below the title. Thanks.

[Christmas]

Personally, I think this is a little absurd. I'm not against making death more riskful, though you can't always get back to your grave, and it'd be annoying to have to pay to have Death Marks removed if you DCed, but this seems like the wrong way. Removing the possibility of drops would have to be worked out carefully; the system could be abused rather easily. And one could just leave one skill under 20 for a long time, like the suposed new skill. The system would have to be worked so the chance would be removed, so as to avoid increasing the drop rates of higher level items. Interesting idea though.
~The

[Hail]

theobymogre, on 22 November 2009 - 08:18 PM, said:

Personally, I think this is a little absurd. I'm not against making death more riskful, though you can't always get back to your grave, and it'd be annoying to have to pay to have Death Marks removed if you DCed, but this seems like the wrong way. Removing the possibility of drops would have to be worked out carefully; the system could be abused rather easily. And one could just leave one skill under 20 for a long time, like the suposed new skill. The system would have to be worked so the chance would be removed, so as to avoid increasing the drop rates of higher level items. Interesting idea though.
~The

I don't see how it could be abused. Think of it this way: instead of older items being removed from the chance, making rare items easier to get, their place is simply taken up by nothing. Say you had a 50% chance of getting a 50K drop and a 50% chance of a dragon chain, but you can't get the 50k, instead of making the dragon chain 100%, it would change to 50% nothing, 50% dragon chain.

All the same, the system is being revamped vastly, so it's really more of a "critique the idea" than "critique the specifics" right now.

[Goyatuzo]

I do not see the way the system could be abused. Losing the chance of receiving drops little by little is only negative in my opinion. At first it will seems like nothing big, but as deaths accumulate the price to die becomes greater. When you're level 100, you have to pay either 2M with one mark, or 20M just to reduce ten marks to nine. It should be harsher on high levels so they feel a greater impact on death. If you're going to a difficult area, then in my opinion, it's only natural to be more heavily prepared for that "accident" that may occur.

I think you took the level 20 the opposite of what I meant it to say. If any of your skills are above level 20, then the marks begin to accumulate. If ALL your skills are below 20, you don't get marks.

[Demilict]

I just want to go back to the days when I could loot some idiot when they died. :o

[Hail]

Demilict, on 22 November 2009 - 09:29 PM, said:

I just want to go back to the days when I could loot some idiot when they died. :o

I guarantee that that's never going to happen, unless you count the return of RuneScape Classic servers. Not only would it violate the whole point of a trade limit, but scamming would be rampant.

[enterprise]

Terrible idea. It's already frustrating enough if you die and lose stuff. Not everybody can return to their gravestone in time. And now you also lose chance on drops when you die, why influence drop % with deaths? It's also worse enough that you lose exp to clear your marks.
What if a hacker is on your account and dies simultaneously and loses exp? That'd be terrible right?
Sorry I don't see this idea working, gravestones are fine imo.

[Christmas]

Hail, on 22 November 2009 - 10:00 PM, said:

theobymogre, on 22 November 2009 - 08:18 PM, said:

Personally, I think this is a little absurd. I'm not against making death more riskful, though you can't always get back to your grave, and it'd be annoying to have to pay to have Death Marks removed if you DCed, but this seems like the wrong way. Removing the possibility of drops would have to be worked out carefully; the system could be abused rather easily. And one could just leave one skill under 20 for a long time, like the suposed new skill. The system would have to be worked so the chance would be removed, so as to avoid increasing the drop rates of higher level items. Interesting idea though.
~The

I don't see how it could be abused. Think of it this way: instead of older items being removed from the chance, making rare items easier to get, their place is simply taken up by nothing. Say you had a 50% chance of getting a 50K drop and a 50% chance of a dragon chain, but you can't get the 50k, instead of making the dragon chain 100%, it would change to 50% nothing, 50% dragon chain.

All the same, the system is being revamped vastly, so it's really more of a "critique the idea" than "critique the specifics" right now.

What I meant more was that it would have to be designed carefully to ensure no abuse would be possible, sorry.

Goyatuzo, on 22 November 2009 - 10:00 PM, said:

I do not see the way the system could be abused. Losing the chance of receiving drops little by little is only negative in my opinion. At first it will seems like nothing big, but as deaths accumulate the price to die becomes greater. When you're level 100, you have to pay either 2M with one mark, or 20M just to reduce ten marks to nine. It should be harsher on high levels so they feel a greater impact on death. If you're going to a difficult area, then in my opinion, it's only natural to be more heavily prepared for that "accident" that may occur.

I think you took the level 20 the opposite of what I meant it to say. If any of your skills are above level 20, then the marks begin to accumulate. If ALL your skills are below 20, you don't get marks.

Ah, that'd be fine. Sorry.

enterprise, on 23 November 2009 - 09:08 AM, said:

What if a hacker is on your account and dies simultaneously and loses exp? That'd be terrible right?
Sorry I don't see this idea working, gravestones are fine imo.

Hacker's destroying your experience would be problematic; there's plenty of pointlessly cruel people out there. Some may even try to hijack the "hi"scores.
It would be very slow to ever get all your experience though, seeing as the 10% decreases over time.

[Goyatuzo]

theobymogre, on 23 November 2009 - 08:28 AM, said:

enterprise, on 23 November 2009 - 09:08 AM, said:

What if a hacker is on your account and dies simultaneously and loses exp? That'd be terrible right?
Sorry I don't see this idea working, gravestones are fine imo.

Hacker's destroying your experience would be problematic; there's plenty of pointlessly cruel people out there. Some may even try to hijack the "hi"scores.
It would be very slow to ever get all your experience though, seeing as the 10% decreases over time.

Other way around. The 10% increases over time because you get more experience in each level. 1,000,000 xp in attack means 100,000 xp lost in attack for each point. Since each skill is independent from one another, the 100,000 xp loss is only relevant in attack and not any other skill.

As for enterprise (the user), you should take precaution to PREVENT hacking. Creating an idea wrapped around the belief the account WILL be hacked is not a good idea. It makes players feel they can get hacked but everything will be alright. I want to punish people who choose to be ignorant by saying "Oh no! I got hacked! I don't know what to do!" when it is obvious most of the "hackings" are done by the owner willingly giving out their own information. If every negative action in RuneScape has an equally or greater punishing action (Can't find the right words), then the RuneScape population should be more involved in the security of their accounts.

In short, I think this idea would help promote account security; especially for higher levels because you do NOT want to lose precious experience you have gained in your time played.

This post has been edited by Goyatuzo: 23 November 2009 - 03:35 PM

[bolshevik]

Probably veering a little off-topic with this post here, but most hackings do not actually involve the owner giving out their information willingly, it's quite the opposite. True, it can happen here and there for the lower levels who do it unknowingly, but 90% of hackings actually do not have the owner going around, giving out their account information.

The only other problem I see with this is the correlation between dying and losing chances at getting great drops, and actually giving away your trained experience in order to actually be able to get these drops in the future. If someone dies accidentally, why would you punish them by them not being able to get a drop because of certain stupidity? And the only way for them to get a chance at getting the drops they want, is to get rid of experience that they have worked hard for.

I just don't see what the great idea is behind dying, and then losing the ability to receive a rare drop. A lot of people die by accident, and none of them should be punished by in fact not being able to get the drops that they long to get.

[orangeperson]

I think this idea is fine but it needs some tweaking. For example, to retrieve something worth 50k at combat 100, I would have to pay 4 mil. The xp loss is also very steep. Something like 1/20 of the xp to get from the previous level to your current level in ONE skill would be better I think

[Goyatuzo]

Bolshevik, on 23 November 2009 - 03:52 PM, said:

Probably veering a little off-topic with this post here, but most hackings do not actually involve the owner giving out their information willingly, it's quite the opposite. True, it can happen here and there for the lower levels who do it unknowingly, but 90% of hackings actually do not have the owner going around, giving out their account information.

The only other problem I see with this is the correlation between dying and losing chances at getting great drops, and actually giving away your trained experience in order to actually be able to get these drops in the future. If someone dies accidentally, why would you punish them by them not being able to get a drop because of certain stupidity? And the only way for them to get a chance at getting the drops they want, is to get rid of experience that they have worked hard for.

I just don't see what the great idea is behind dying, and then losing the ability to receive a rare drop. A lot of people die by accident, and none of them should be punished by in fact not being able to get the drops that they long to get.

About the hacking note - what is the majority then? I thought it was both scamming and trusting sites that offer macros.

Primarily, you still have the chance of getting a good drop. In fact, you need to die 7 times in order to lose the ability to get drops worth 500k in the Grand Exchange. I want to create that horror in dying in the game which is so absent in recent times. Every player gets equal treatment when they die? I didn't like that concept that much from the beginning. If a high level dies, then the stakes should be that much greater compared to a low level. One can argue they lose Dragon as opposed to Rune, but I don't see how someone wouldn't have prepared for such an event. The higher leveled you are, the more "knowledge" you have, and so preparing for an activity should become easier. There should be a constant fear of death in the game, and the current system allows a large fail-safe. If you die, you just have to teleport near the location you died and be sure you can run back there. 6 minutes is an awful long time and I'm sure most areas can be re-trekked and reached if teleported to the correct area. (Correct me if I'm wrong on this... My world map is about 4 years old)

orangeperson, on 23 November 2009 - 03:59 PM, said:

I think this idea is fine but it needs some tweaking. For example, to retrieve something worth 50k at combat 100, I would have to pay 4 mil. The xp loss is also very steep. Something like 1/20 of the xp to get from the previous level to your current level in ONE skill would be better I think

I think you've mistaken drops with bank withdrawls. The only component of the game that is effected by this is the drops from monsters when you kill them. The drops will be valued in Grand Exchange prices. The XP thing itself, some people have told me the loss is too steep, so I reduced it from 10% to 7%.

This post has been edited by Goyatuzo: 23 November 2009 - 04:25 PM

[Hail]

Way too much experience lost. Maybe 1%, but 7 is just crazy. 10 deaths would be catastrophic, even if you can pay it off without wasting exp.

[Christmas]

Goyatuzo, on 23 November 2009 - 04:34 PM, said:

theobymogre, on 23 November 2009 - 08:28 AM, said:

enterprise, on 23 November 2009 - 09:08 AM, said:

What if a hacker is on your account and dies simultaneously and loses exp? That'd be terrible right?
Sorry I don't see this idea working, gravestones are fine imo.

Hacker's destroying your experience would be problematic; there's plenty of pointlessly cruel people out there. Some may even try to hijack the "hi"scores.
It would be very slow to ever get all your experience though, seeing as the 10% decreases over time.

Other way around. The 10% increases over time because you get more experience in each level. 1,000,000 xp in attack means 100,000 xp lost in attack for each point. Since each skill is independent from one another, the 100,000 xp loss is only relevant in attack and not any other skill.

As for enterprise (the user), you should take precaution to PREVENT hacking. Creating an idea wrapped around the belief the account WILL be hacked is not a good idea. It makes players feel they can get hacked but everything will be alright. I want to punish people who choose to be ignorant by saying "Oh no! I got hacked! I don't know what to do!" when it is obvious most of the "hackings" are done by the owner willingly giving out their own information. If every negative action in RuneScape has an equally or greater punishing action (Can't find the right words), then the RuneScape population should be more involved in the security of their accounts.

In short, I think this idea would help promote account security; especially for higher levels because you do NOT want to lose precious experience you have gained in your time played.

A bit harsh. many hackings are from people being stupid- but it's a learning process. You can't punish everyone that's stupid, besides, the consequences of their actions already does that. And some hackings happen to the best of our ability to avoid them And 7% is still way to much.
~The

[Goyatuzo]

theobymogre, on 23 November 2009 - 09:59 PM, said:

Goyatuzo, on 23 November 2009 - 04:34 PM, said:

theobymogre, on 23 November 2009 - 08:28 AM, said:

enterprise, on 23 November 2009 - 09:08 AM, said:

What if a hacker is on your account and dies simultaneously and loses exp? That'd be terrible right?
Sorry I don't see this idea working, gravestones are fine imo.

Hacker's destroying your experience would be problematic; there's plenty of pointlessly cruel people out there. Some may even try to hijack the "hi"scores.
It would be very slow to ever get all your experience though, seeing as the 10% decreases over time.

Other way around. The 10% increases over time because you get more experience in each level. 1,000,000 xp in attack means 100,000 xp lost in attack for each point. Since each skill is independent from one another, the 100,000 xp loss is only relevant in attack and not any other skill.

As for enterprise (the user), you should take precaution to PREVENT hacking. Creating an idea wrapped around the belief the account WILL be hacked is not a good idea. It makes players feel they can get hacked but everything will be alright. I want to punish people who choose to be ignorant by saying "Oh no! I got hacked! I don't know what to do!" when it is obvious most of the "hackings" are done by the owner willingly giving out their own information. If every negative action in RuneScape has an equally or greater punishing action (Can't find the right words), then the RuneScape population should be more involved in the security of their accounts.

In short, I think this idea would help promote account security; especially for higher levels because you do NOT want to lose precious experience you have gained in your time played.

A bit harsh. many hackings are from people being stupid- but it's a learning process. You can't punish everyone that's stupid, besides, the consequences of their actions already does that. And some hackings happen to the best of our ability to avoid them And 7% is still way to much.
~The

It is a learning process, and it's a process that usually is met at within the first couple months of playing - where money is not a huge issue. As you level up, theoretically you should become more intelligent in determining which deals are scams, hacks, and legitimate deals. So, I made sure that newbies cannot be held responsible (hence the below level 20 part) and even after that, their consequence is generally really low. Combat Level x 100 x points. (Added a new tier to costs)

Since many people still believe 7% is too high, I'm going to reduce the number yet again. I want it to be fair, but at the same time difficult enough to deter people from dying by trying risky things.

Does 2% sound somewhat logical? 20,000 xp if your base is 1,000,000.

This post has been edited by Goyatuzo: 23 November 2009 - 10:09 PM

[Lord_Ariman]

I don't like this at all.
The idea of delevelling is absurd. Reminds me of WoW and Flyff.

[Hail]

Lord_Ariman, on 24 November 2009 - 01:58 AM, said:

I don't like this at all.
The idea of delevelling is absurd. Reminds me of WoW and Flyff.

While delevelling is something I'm kinda unsure about, and I've never played Flyff, it doesn't exist in WoW (unless you count erasing professions, but that's just because you can only have 2 at a time and that doesn't relate to this at all).